Sir duckles is probably kp free and is goneee lol... (just kiddin) hahaha

I am jumping on the sea buckthorn bandwagon, too. I purchased a 3.6 oz bar soap and 8 oz. lotion directly from Aubrey Organics for $25 shipped--not bad. They have a guarantee, so if the products don't work, I can return them within 90 days if I have used less than half and exchange for another product. I'm not going to start using them until I quit my job in a few weeks (totally unrelated to my skin) and can stay home all day and be broken out and not have to see anyone.

Right now I am not doing anything to treat the KP on my body and I have it...well let's just say everywhere except my feet and hands and parts of my calves. And my ears. I can tell it has recently started creeping down to my calves and forearms, which is really distressing since those are almost the only parts of my body that don't have KP. Due to my itchy eyelids, extremely oily hair, occasional inexplicable itchiness on my torso, and ineffectiveness of other attempts to cure my KP, plus a general feeling of tiredness that I've had for about 10 years and can't be explained by anything, I'm hoping that I have a demodex problem and this will make everything better. I'll let you know how it goes, but I won't be starting the treatment for six weeks (mid February).

Hope, the theory is that some people have a reaction to the mites, while others don't. Since most people have these mites on their bodies, and see no negative effect.

HI everyone!

So sorry I have been gone for so long. I was swept up with work and moving and just didn't have any time to reply to my thread.

FIRST here's an update from me!

KP is slowly fading further, now reduced 60%. The rate of reduction has been somewhat different on different parts of my body. My legs for example, were probably the most stubborn (which have now just started to really clear up!) while my back cleared up long ago. Overall though, my skin is the best it's ever been. Even if it doesn't improve any further, I'll be happy!! But if it continues to disappear into nothing, I'll be one happy chick.

I DID have a second breakout, a couple of weeks ago. This involved some acne like bumps and a small resurgence of my KP. This was right on track though, as the second generation of demodex parasites were just hatching. A full cycle takes about 30 days and the eggs are not affected by the Sea Buckthorn themselves. So once the eggs are laid (which is quite alot) you're looking at 7-10 days of just dormancy before they hatch and you've got a mini-breakout on your hands. I should really add this to the guide.

But, just like in the past, it fades within a week or two. It is a little disheartening, but trust me stick with it as everything is going according to plan.

It's been about 2 and a half months, and by month 4 it should be really interesting to see where I'm at! I'm now thinking that around 5 months I should have barely any KP at all. (I'm hoping!)

I also skipped a week or two on my Sea Buckthorn drink and my reduction slowed down. Lesson learned! Now back to taking it again everyday.



Ok, let me go into Sea Buckthorn products really quick.


First off, do NOT buy "Dr.Hauschka Skin Care Apricot & Seabuckthorn Shampoo"as it's disgusting. It smells, looks, and feels horrible. I can best discribe it as rubbing watery liquid rubber into your hair. Afterwards your hair feels nasty and I did not notice any improvement while using it. Total waste of 13 bucks! I want to use it because I spent money on it, but it will probably end up in the trash.

Drink, Drink, Drink. I can't recommend that enough. It really helps speed up the process and the weeks I don't take it I notice a significant "slowing" in the reduction of my KP. As for the capsules, I'm not sure- I still really prefer the drink because the results are so noticeable. I'll continue to take the capsules but keep in mind that the recommendation for the capsules are "2-4 a day" so if you are only taking one, you might not see that much of a difference. You'll be taking alot more Sea Buckthorn with the drink. Also, the drink comes from the Sea Buckthorn Berry, while the capsules come from the Sea Buckthorn Seed. What the difference is, I don't know, although I wish I did. They may not contain the same chemicals so they may be vastly different.

My regimen is still:
1) Aubrey Organics Sea Buckthorn Soap
2) Face Doctor Sea Buckthorn Shampoo
3) Occasionally, Face Doctor Soap. I still haven't seen a huge difference between the Aubrey and Face doctor brands. I'll keep testing though!
4) Sea Buckthorn Drink- but I sometimes forget to take it and that's when I see the slowdown in reduction.

When I had my second breakout, it was especially noticeable on my face so I started to use Aubrey Organics Sea Buckthorn toner and face moisturizer. After about a week my face had pretty much returned to normal.



To reply to some of the folks who asked:

The reason you break out after using Sea Buckthorn is most likely due to the decomposing mites in your skin. This makes a perfect haven for bacteria which feast on the decaying mites. This in turn causes an infection of the area which your body attempts to fight- just like a pimple, hence the resulting pus.

As for why light exposure / tanning does not simply kill all the mites off - because not all of them live within lights reach! There are actually two kinds of mites that you are dealing with- one lives near the surface, feasting on Sebum in the hair follicles. They tend to dive into the hair follicles during the day which helps them avoid most of the light. The second version of the might live deeper within the skin, which may not get any light at all. They live right in the sebum producing glands, which may also be the cause for the really deep skin pimples many of us get. The pimples are not in the pores, but deep within the glands next to the pores. This makes the pimples especially painful as they are closer to more nerve endings than say, an infection of just a hair follicle or pore alone. And finally, the eggs themselves are laid inside the hair follicle and may not be as sensitive to light. When they hatch in 7-10 days, you've got yourself a new generation of mites on you.

That's why this process takes as long as it does- over the course of several months you are fighting numerous generations of mites on several different layers of your skin. You'll go through ups and downs, but eventually if you stick with it and use a strong regimen, you *should* be able to reduce your KP to near nothingness, or eliminate it completely.

As for what causes some people to have this and others not to:

Yes, nearly everyone in the world has this mite- and we easily pass the mites between each other in our day to day lives, mostly with those we are physically close with as the mites can't survive long without a host. The reason we have severe negative reactions to the host is due to a form of genetic disposition. This could be in form of a genetically weaker immune system, a genetic disorder that results in our bodies either reacting negatively toward the mites, or our bodies not being able to control or respond to the mite population. The cause either way is genetic as most of us have found we inherited or shared this trait with a relative- the trait being passed down from one family line.

I think that's it. If anyone has any questions I'll be happy to answer them! I'm going through my PMs now and will try to answer everyone the best I can.

Keep on SBing I look forward to hearing your results! And I'm also interested to see how many people this actually affects!

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SirDuckles

Wow you are fantastic for putting this together and it makes sence, as I have gone through all your same symtoms - scalp etc. Never had an issue till 15 years ago, last year was bad on the legs - Very itchy.

Suspected it was a parasite as it kind of revolved around hair entrances - even when I pulled every hair out in areas I got a sub skin eruptions in the sebaceous glands, which resulted in light clear discharge and yet there was no acne or plug sometimes If I dug deeper - note to others - don't do that not recommeneded.

I do hope I find all the required supplies here in Australia

Keep up the great work as that the best improved pictures I've seen, I've tried everything else including the craze of oil pulling that only produced clean whiter teeth - at least the denist was impressed I wasn't


Your pictures and symtoms / information are spot on.

Regards,

Ausmartin

Ah, one last thing! I re-ordered my Sea Buckthorn soap a couple weeks ago and by mistake on my part ordered 12 bars or something crazy like that! So I decided to give some to my fiance. He's now on the SBT too!

He does not have KP or any other kind of skin condition for that matter (except for being hot and dreamy) and has a totally different ancestry than mine- he's mostly German, with some other Northern European nationals mixed in. (I'm Philippine/Italian on the other hand)

So far he hasn't noticed much of a difference- although the first week he had some bad acne, which then faded. So he might have had a small reaction where the mites usually are in 90% of the people out there- the face (eyebrows, nose). But as for his hair and the rest of his body, nothing. Even though it didn't do much for him on the rest of his body he still likes the soap. He's using it as shampoo too. He's decided he's going to keep on using it as he's interested in seeing if it will reduce his occasional breakout. (Plus it might keep me keep from getting reinfected quickly if he is purged of the mites too- as I'm constantly all over his sexy bod)

So I will keep you updated on the progress of my handsome man! As I know many of you have the Sea Buckthorn soap in hand and are looking toward fellow family members with an evil grin.

Ok, that's it! For real this time!

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[quote=Hope4thebest;33839]Personally, I don't think "contageous mites" are the cause."

You have to realise some people are alergic to certain things. These mites are on 96-98% of people however some of us are allergic to them - otherwise we wouldn't be on this kp forum.

Eg. I am allergic to cats - fur that is, If I pat a cat and then accidently touch my face and corner of eye, my skin will go redder in that area and the eye will get all sandy and weep. Lot of people aren't allegic to cats but I am. The same can apply to these mites. Most people have them & have no reaction to them.

Everybody's imune system is different and different reactions.

I never had KP as a kid,
So Why after I went OS when over 25 for a holiday, It all started something changed and all the dermatologists had various explanations & treatments that have not worked. It's didn't make any sence as it spread slowly intially to every just about every hair folical I've got !

The treatment shows very positive pictures, much more than what I would see in seasonal variations myself.

Lets give it a wirl I say.

with above post!


One last thing that I forgot! I'm moving back to Pennsylvania in just a few weeks. Right now I live in Florida where it is sunny and warm and humid all year round, double that in the summer of course.

It should be interesting how this affects my KP- going from a warm, sunny, humid climate to a cold, dark and arid climate. I'm really putting my KP to the test it seems!

Hopefully there won't be any noticeable change! (I didn't notice any change when I first moved down here 2 years ago) I will continue tanning up in PA, just as I have been down here (inside only of course).

Will keep you all updated.

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Hi Hope! Maybe I can clear things up a bit.

Because the reaction to the mites is genetic. This means that it is a family trait, passed down through the generations. Sometimes it may skip an entire generation or only affect one of your siblings. That's just how genetics work. I'd go into more detail, but you might as well just read up on the basics of genetics and mendelian inheritance.

Mendelian inheritance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




Right. Not everyone has the same genetics so obviously not everyone will have this. It may only effect a tiny percentage of the people who have the mite. Those with this form of KP will need to either share a common ancestry or their previous ancestry experienced a genetic mutation that would lay the foundation for this type of KP.

Which, the weak immune system could be the result of the genetics which in turn is causing the mite overpopulation or the weak immune system could be the result of the parasite's burden on the immune system itself. I'm sure there are plenty of people out there with weak immune systems who do not have overpopulations of the mite or react the mite like we do. I think it is more likely an paticular genetically caused immune system flaw, and/or a possible taxation on the immune system itself by the mite.


This is true- but remember that the mites will go wherever there is food to be had! And if we happen to produce an over abudence of sebum / other horomones (which is produced in all hair follicles we could easily be harboring the mites all over our bodies.) This would cause them to slowly spread as we age as we start producing sebum and horomones in other parts of our bodies. When we're really young however, it is usually contained to the face, back. As for why we don't have horrible KP on our faces- I know I have KP on my face- right on the sides of my chin. I also know that my acne tends to flare up when my KP does. Why the arms tend to be so bad, not sure- but I'm sure genetics has something to do with it!

Answer found in my last post: "As for why light exposure / tanning does not simply kill all the mites off - because not all of them live within lights reach! There are actually two kinds of mites that you are dealing with- one lives near the surface, feasting on Sebum in the hair follicles. They tend to dive into the hair follicles during the day which helps them avoid most of the light. The second version of the might live deeper within the skin, which may not get any light at all. They live right in the sebum producing glands, which may also be the cause for the really deep skin pimples many of us get. The pimples are not in the pores, but deep within the glands next to the pores. This makes the pimples especially painful as they are closer to more nerve endings than say, an infection of just a hair follicle or pore alone. And finally, the eggs themselves are laid inside the hair follicle and may not be as sensitive to light. When they hatch in 7-10 days, you've got yourself a new generation of mites on you.
"


It's really not that much money, especially since you'd normally be buying soap and shampoo anyway. The shampoo is a little more expensive, yes, but I wouldn't be putting cheapo stuff into my hair anyway. Overall the price really doesn't bother me, especially when it appears to be ridding me of a problem I was once told was incurable. (But I understand if it's expensive where you live of course!)

Oil should have lasted you a little longer I think- did you try mixing it with lotion? I did this and it lasted me for quite a while.

As for the capsules, 1 a day is good to start on, especially if you are unsure how your body will react, but I really recommend on bumping it up to 2-4 capsules a day, like the bottle recommends. I'm trying them out myself, but still prefer the drink. We'll see


Hope this cleared a few things up!

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SirDuckles, does it make sense to you that I broke out uncontrollably on my forehead, after only two applications of sea buckthorn serum? I applied it once one day, and once again the next. And then I stopped, because I was afraid of the escalation. And then it just got worse and worse, and I'm just now fighting it off, after over a week of intensive treatment. That was a complete nightmare, but I bumped into a friend of mine, and I told her about it, and she said that it was probably drawing something out. So I don't know, but it sounds similar to what you're talking about. I just didn't expect to see this happen so fast. And I know that it wasn't just irritating it because it clogged my pores, since SBT is marketed as an acne treatment.

But after only two days? I didn't even apply it to my forehead for any other reason than to nourish the skin in general. I don't have Keratosis Pilaris on my face.

Totally possible. I personally noticed slightly increased acne within the first couple days, but really didn't make anything of it until it was totally out of control by the end of the week. (When it was absolutely insane as the pictures in the first post show)

How fast you react and how badly you react may have to do with your skin type and how many / how bad you have the mites. So it's totally possible in your case that you could have a full blown reaction within 2-3 days.

If you feel brave enough, I'd seriously try applying it to your entire face and allowing it to become a part of your regimen. If it continues to get really bad and your symptoms match the ones in my post, you'll at know that you have the mites for sure. Just make sure that the bumps contain pus and aren't allergy related. (Although I don't know of anyone who is allergic to Sea Buckthorn)

As for why you would breakout on your face even though you don't have KP there- that happened to me too. The reason is that the mites live everywhere, including the face. In fact they are most commonly found on the face, hence their name the "eyelash mite". Why there isn't KP there- the skin on your face is very different than the skin on the rest of your body. It could very well be KP resistant or may not react to the mites in the way the back of our arms do. Our face might just show it as light acne / clogged pores or not show it at all.

In my case I had very light KP on the bottom of my jaw. When I started Sea Buckthorning I broke out all over my face, forehead, nose, everywhere. It was really bad.

And if you do have the mites, you will always have them on your face. It is their favorite place to live in just about everyone. In fact they probably started on your face and as you aged they slowly spread to the rest of your body.


So if you think you can handle the temporary but bad breakout, I'd go for it and start applying it to your face. Just keep a close eye on yourself and make sure it's not an allergic reaction that your seeing (allergic reaction would contain no pus or fluids, and would not be pore related) After about a week or two of a very bad breakout it should start fading on your face.

Try your scalp too if you get the shampoo, you should notice a similar result!

If you decide to skip your face/hair it will be all too easy to get reinfected again by the mites on the rest of your body. I think when you wipe them out, you have to wipe them out everywhere!

Hope this helps!!

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Sorry sirduckles, I'm still not buying that the mites are the cause to KP. It makes no sense that all of a sudden the mites start to grow out of control and overtake the body, and weaken our immune system. If anything, it's the other way around: Our immune system weakens, our body, because of the way it has been genetically programmed to handle imbalances, responds by producing excess keratin (which is what the plugs are), and perhaps the mites (or other bacteria) worsen the condition by causing inflammation and what not. However the mites do not cause KP IMHO. If so, then why does KP also go away by us simply clearing the pores with AHA or dermabrasion? Is that supposed to wipe out the mites, too? Or why does KP seem to go away by "cleansing" the body, like Baronster or Rachel have done?

I don't dispute the fact that SBT MAY be working for KP, but I think it's for reasons other than killing the mites.

I don't think I ever said mites are the sole cause of KP- as I don't believe that myself. KP is not a black and white issue and I think in many cases people who claim to have KP may have something entirely different. There are so many factors at play with our skin that I think it would be silly to say one thing alone would cause KP and everyone could be cured the same way. Otherwise I don't think there'd be this form and so many different "cures" posted to it with such a mixed reaction to all of them from the KPed forum members.

I think you have to look at it as there are multiple ways to end up with KP. Some folks might just naturally produce a bucket load of Keratin, while others might produce it as a reaction to something affecting their system. As a result there probably won't be a one cure fits all, I think people will have to experiment until they find what works and counters their specific cause. (which may even be multiple things!) SBT for me, is what works- I have with little doubt now that I have the Demodex form of KP.

And sadly, the fact of the matter is there hasn't been enough good scientific research done on KP, which doesn't help. The cold, monotone response we so often get from our doctors goes to show this. KP is not well understood and may of us are trying our best to understand it. And what maybe makes it so much more difficult is that it's not all the same thing for everyone (the difference could be as small as what initially causes it, but produces the same looking result) and I'm sure there's plenty of misdiagnoses to go around.

As for your particular theory on the role of the mites, it's entirely possible! There are many ways to look at this and I'm sure that the mites could even play a different role in different people. The bottom line behind any of these demodex theories is that the mites, one's immune system, and some types of KP are related by either cause or reaction- that much we do know. SBT helps, by either killing the mites or countering the bodies failed reaction to the mites, reducing KP, hopefully (as others have found) into nothingness.

As for AHA or dermabrasion, hypothetically speaking, I'm sure it'd have some kind of effect on the mite population. AHA is powerful stuff and if it burns your skin to the point of peeling I'm sure it would kill mites. But the mites can also live deeper within the skin (sebum glands), which would be hard to get at with the AHA. Maybe that's why some people have mixed results with AHA. And how it effects the demodex eggs is another story.

When it comes to Baronster and Rachel- I'm not familiar with what they used. Diet change? Either way, yes, it could affect the mites or their food supply. But in their paticular cases, they probably had a totally different kind of KP as I think many people do.

That's why I suggested that everyone should try the SBT at least once, because by the end of it at the very least they'll be able to rule out mites as the cause/reaction of their KP. If the SBT helps, then congrats to them because they've found their possible cause of KP and are able to treat it.

KP, skin, life in general is so incredibly complex and I think we sometimes fool ourselves into thinking there's a simple solution or a simple answer to everything. With KP, or even the demodex parasite, I think there are many, many ways one could end up with it and many ways SBT might help. It's anyone's guess and so that's why I suggest at least trying it.

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Certainly it is true of many diseases that, to find the cure, one must find the individual cause of their illness. It's about finding the cause, and I am convinced that Demodex is quite possibly one of the top causes of the condition. I think Keratosis Pilaris is somewhat of a generic reaction. As Duckles said, it appears that one method may work for one person, and not another, simply because the cause is different.

SirDuckles, I didn't mention this yesterday, but I've been working on one arm with Sea Buckthorn body lotion for over a week, aswell as doing the dermabrasion with another product unrelated. And the one arm that I've been doing this on was finally pretty soft yesterday. My mom was shocked, and I hadn't realized how much better it had gotten. The red bumps weren't as close together, not like on the other arm. And it was just soft. Then today it's just red and inflamed, with more bumps! And it's just been breaking out in acne pustules. Not severenly, but at least a few at any given time. And only on that one arm!

The dermabrasion has definitely been a huge part of this. But suddenly it's like I took a step back. Somehow I think there's no way these bumps can build that fast. I have no idea what's going on.


And thank you so much for your reply!!

I don't really want to do that with my face. I'm frankly very afraid of what could happen. I've been through hell and back this last while with my skin. But, I figure I might try it at some point later.

You know, one of the most confusing things about this condition is that the inflammation changes throughout the day. I don't know, it just toys with my mind.

By the way, I've also added once a week ginger baths to my plan of attack. My friend shared this with me, she said it would help. It's just another little thing I've added to my arsenal.

I've got 3 anti-inflammatories going on my skin once a day, let's hope it gives in eventually.

i plan on trying sea buckthorn soon, but my digestive system is bad and i have ibs so i don't want the die off the mites to overwhelm my system. and... the mites and its toxins have to be eliminated properly for the sea buckthorn to work or no? i'm not allowed to drink cold stuff because of my stomach, and the drink has to be refrigerated ? can i mix it with some warm water?

hopefully mites are the problem. 3 summers ago, i took a round of antibiotics and a week or two later, i went out in the sun without sunblock and stayed there for like 6 hrs. my skin cracked and peeled and voila the keratosis disappeared and i had smooth non dry arms. then 6 months after, it came back. of course the nice dose of antibiotics also gave me ibs constipation type so i'm sure i was storing in some nice mites in my body due to improper elimination. also that wasn't my first sun burn either...lassstt useless thing i ramble about...keratosis appeared on my arms when i was a toddler supposedly after some sort of pox.